I need your help with a simple experiment...

[CREGAN]

So..... What is the verdict? Anyone have any observations or other things they have noticed about trying the expirament?

Craig

[nxski]

So..... What is the verdict? Anyone have any observations or other things they have noticed about trying the expirament?

Craig

Yes, I've noticed that I don't drive my van enough! I have 5L of oil to test and haven't filled up once since this experiment started!

[jessef]

So..... What is the verdict? Anyone have any observations or other things they have noticed about trying the expirament?

Craig

yep. I've been using it in every diesel I've ever owned including the L300/L400 and Paj's

I've been an advocate for 2-stroke additive since the 90's in our mazda pu. It works and our engines love it.

[psilosin]

How about 2-stroke snowmobile oil? Its on sale at Canadian Tire for quite a bit cheaper than the 2-stroke marine outboard oil.

[tonydca]

Can't comment on snowmobile vs outboard oil; I'm just sticking to one product for the winter to see if things are consistent.

This last fillup, I did a full tank finishing a 400 km session of hideous, short-distance, 9-km trips, city driving, stop and starts, often never really warming up - basically the worst possible performance conditions for a diesel like this.

Normally I get around 14.6L/100km in this case during the winter.

This last fill was 13.7.

[naterade]

So then, if we are losing fuel economy due to the addition of anti-gel additives in the fuel, and we add 2-stroke oil to improve fuel economy, are we compromising the anti-gel properties of the winter diesel?

I can understand this not being as much an issue on the west coast, but what about here in cold Calgary? I would like to try this, but not if it means ending up with diesel jell-o in my tank

[psilosin]

So then, if we are losing fuel economy due to the addition of anti-gel additives in the fuel, and we add 2-stroke oil to improve fuel economy, are we compromising the anti-gel properties of the winter diesel?

I can understand this not being as much an issue on the west coast, but what about here in cold Calgary? I would like to try this, but not if it means ending up with diesel jell-o in my tank

Thats another reason I was curious about snowmobile 2 stroke oil. Each brand makes a point on the bottle to state how cold it can go (ie -45oC) so was thinking it must be thinner or have its own flow modifiers to keep it from turning to molasses.

[CREGAN]

So then, if we are losing fuel economy due to the addition of anti-gel additives in the fuel, and we add 2-stroke oil to improve fuel economy, are we compromising the anti-gel properties of the winter diesel?

I can understand this not being as much an issue on the west coast, but what about here in cold Calgary? I would like to try this, but not if it means ending up with diesel jell-o in my tank

I agree and am also curious. Minus 20 is kind of a normal winter day round here so if I stop using my antigel (Howes) will the 2 stroke gel up or allow for gelling in my tank?

Craig

[Fishtank]

I wouldn't worry about it guys, I'm 99% sure that the addition of 2-stroke oil will have no effect on the anti-gelling properties of your fuel.

Also realize that the addition of anti-gel additive is not needed if you are running with 'Winter Grade' diesel, which everyone should be converted to at this time of the year in Calgary. They have already compensated for the use in low temperatures at the refinery. You only need to add anti-gel additive if you will be trying to run 'Summer' diesel in temperatures below it's pour point.

The decrease in mileage when running Winter diesel is mainly due to the drop in the cetane number when the refineries create the blend. Why the 2-stroke oil improves the mileage... no clue. A simple cetane booster will probably do the same for us.

As for the 2-stroke oil gelling up in your tank, about the only way that could occur is if you added it after you fuel up. if you add it before (which is what everybody does right?), it will get diluted by the diesel enough not to become a factor.

Hope this helps.

[nxski]

Apparently outboard 2 stroke oil contains a tcw3 additive so for whatever reason this is not as desirable at a straight motorcycle or snowmobile oil.

[oceanchem]

Here are my most recent numbers but only based on 3 tanks of fuel with regular cetane additive. This last fill-up the Outboard additive went in. Will have more to report in a week or so as we go through this tank with mostly city driving. Cheers,

Jay

[tonydca]

Apparently outboard 2 stroke oil contains a tcw3 additive so for whatever reason this is not as desirable at a straight motorcycle or snowmobile oil.

TC-W3 is a specification; "Two-Cycle, Water-cooled, spec#3 (the latest)". I think the spec calls for an oil with little to no ash upon burning, and enhanced lubricating properties for a two-stroke engine vs. a four-stroke. Supposedly the "good stuff".:

http://www.rbbi.com/folders/recb/tcw33.htm

And I think the earlier comment regarding a temperature rating of -45degC for the oil might be the temperature at which the 100% 2-stroke oil gels up inside its container.

Gasoline gels up at -90 degC and I can't imagine adding 2% oil (50:1 mix) would raise that point too dramatically for a snowmobile.

So I'm guessing that for us to add a 200:1 mix of oil to winter diesel won't raise the resulting gel point too much.

But that's just a West-Coaster talkin'

PS: Just did a run down to LaConner, WA last weekend, keeping it at or above 120 km/h on the highway, average 11.8L/100kms which is good summer mileage figures for me.

I'm wondering if the added oil is changing the cetane/energy density/??? enough to make it act more like summer diesel.

[pajerry]

I tried the same two stroke oil for the past three fills and have noticed a slight increase in smoothness, maybe economy, but the average of the three tanks is barely less than what I clocked before @ about 14/100kms. Just like Tony, this was short trips, short warm-ups, and when it is warm a heavy foot. I should add that I always add an ounce or two of that cetane booster CVI and injector shops recommend. (forget the name) Probably why I there probably isn't much difference. Basically the same stuff.

To be honest the first tank in, I thought it was smoother and clocking more KMS.. Then I got squat out of the second half! Maybe blame my right foot..

Interested in seeing on how you fare long term, but either way at 1.43/L, I just suck it up and pump away

[CREGAN]

I just signed up for Fuelly. How do you guys add the little picture and KM/L thing to the bottom of your replys?

On a side note: I am planning on starting the expirament at the end of this tank, but I just figured out that on the way out to Vancouver last week I was getting 14.2L/100km (1211km, 172L of fuel) with a leaking injection pump. Driving home with all new seals I got 11.6L/100km (1289km, 149L of fuel). I am finally content with my sweet piece of Delica

Craig

[Fishtank]

I am finally content with my sweet piece of Delica

Craig

Great to hear Craig, you deserve it for all you've gone through, and your monster drive.

So I'm guessing that for us to add a 200:1 mix of oil to winter diesel won't raise the resulting gel point too much.

Nope, not even close.

I'm wondering if the added oil is changing the cetane/energy density/??? enough to make it act more like summer diesel.

Not at a 200:1 mix ratio.