Delica Canada | Mitsubishi Van Club

Green1 wrote:Do you go offroading with a globe? or a local map?
over the distances on a local map, it's irrelevant.

Green1 wrote:When and why GPS was made is irrelevant to the discussion 1 . GPS again has NO information about land masses, rivers, roads, or any other feature, only your location on this planet 2 . as for "they made new maps"... who is "they"? 3 every map is made by a different company, and most use data much newer than 1984... and surprisingly (for you) 4 many still put that NEW data on a NAD27 datum... because the DATUM is UNRELATED to the DATA 5 . Each cartographer does things differently, the DATA is not "public domain" and there is no magic 1984 view of the world with all the features on it that is being used here.6
Just the SHAPE of the globe.

you MUST use the same datum that your map uses, no matter what 7. And disregarding a perfect map because you don't like the datum would be a very silly move indeed!

Many maps are still published in NAD27, I'm not going to avoid them to get a WGS84 map that is WORSE! 8

The DATA is serperate from the DATUM, 9 you just don't seem to understand that the 2 are completely, 100% unrelated.

Think of the datum as a piece of paper, if I use a 1927 piece of paper, or a 1984 piece of paper has no bearing whatsoever on the map I draw on it with my pen 10 . the paper is blank until the cratographer draws on it

• [1] Actually, it was made relevant to the discussion prior to Max pointing out the error of my grammar in a paragraph in the first post I made answering Ursula's question regarding advice for going off road. It is pretty much the "raison d'être" of this thread.
  
  [2] Well, yes and no. The global location on this planet happens to involve land masses, rivers, roads & other features.
  
  [3] "They" is all them other guys that formed those companies you go on about after you asked this question in the first place (twice removed from the original eighth place )
  
  [4] I know. I am not surprised. It seems that measuring the longitudinal co-ordinates from my mate's NAD83 GPS dropped me sixty odd minutes west into the Pacific Ocean on my WGS84 oriented GPS. Somewhat disturbing at around midnight in the bush somewhere. I briefly mentioned this a few posts back.
  
  [5] Oh, I know, mate. I made a grammatical error and a descriptive omission in the original paragraph that started all this. It was pointed out by Max, bless his heart, and, amongst other things, I answered back with "...originally based on 1984 data* (not to be confused with Map Datum). ...". Remember? You quoted that. I understand that the Datum is the "type" of Chassis or platform the map is built on and not the Data that makes up the picture that is the map. I have never disagreed with you on that point.
  
  [6] You are referring back to your comment regarding my comment about the origins of GPS in the public domain. Before Korean Air Lines flight 007 was shot down in '83 GPS was a military thing, only. After that incident President Reagan announced that GPS would be available to "civilians". As of 17 January, 1994 there were 24 satellites in the sky telling us where to go. Now there are 31. My reference to the maps is with the advent of WGS84 (also NAD83UTM -Max mentioned) as a different building platform ~ they, you know... them, the cartographers that be ~ had to build new maps to fit the new building platforms that is the new Map Datum. Otherwise people would be driving off cliffs into the Pacific Ocean instead of just getting lost down some deactivated logging road. Which really brings us back to the beginning of this ordeal: Like the Internet, GPS maps are not updated by one group of people. It is updated potentially by everyone who report where something has changed and the cartographers; Mr. Garmin; Mr. Tomtom; Mr. Magellan; et al ~ enter these changes into the respective maps. Some parts of the world have eluded the public eye and when driving in remote areas you must beware as you might just find that one of these forest mains is grown over with fallen trees and rotten bridges and sinking causeways, &c..
  
  [7] Agreed.
  
  [8] Fair enough.
  
  [9] Agreed, we covered that back on [5]. I might add 'though, that the Map Datum will determine the way in which the map is drawn, of course.
  
  [10] Well, on the 1927 piece of paper you will be using a two dimensional series pen and on the 1984 piece of paper you will be using a three dimensional series pen (w/digital harmonic capabilities). On the 1927 piece of paper you will be calculating from Meades Ranch in Kansas, on the 1984 piece of paper you will be calculating from the centre of the Earth to as high as the heavens above ~ in a three dimensional walnut shell.

[2] Well, yes and no. The global location on this planet happens to involve land masses, rivers, roads & other features.

FalcoColumbarius wrote:Firesong, you were mentioning about the accuracy of GPS these days ~

When I first loaded up my Garmin/Nroute system I decided to go for a drive. I plotted a course up the Fraser Canyon with a stop over at this cool coffee place in Hope called "The Blue Moose" (you'd probably like this place). When I got to the cafe there was no parking immediately in front of it so I parked across the street, no big deal, right? Had my coffee, got back in my wagon and proceeded up the Number 1. As I am driving up the road my GPS keeps telling me that I have to turn around because I have yet to arrive at the Blue Moose ~ because I parked across the street and walked the rest of the way ~ my van never made it to the Blue Moose. This was trippy. GPS can be a great pastime, still learning.

Green1 wrote:Most modern automotive GPS units can tell you what lane you are driving in on a multi-lane roadway, and GPS can be accurate to within less than a metre, your problem wasn't that the GPS was too accurate, it was that the programmer wasn't forgiving enough. A good programmer will set it up such that you "arrive" when you are within a hundred metres or so, and failing that, will set it so that it shows as visited once you proceed deliberately past the location.
I find some are better than others at this, I found that Microsoft Streets and Trips was horrid at this, my TomTom is hit or miss, and my old garmin was pretty good.

FalcoColumbarius wrote:I am unaware that one could programme the accuracy of any given destination. Where would I find this feature in the menu?

psilosin wrote:Laura...your Delica is lifted REALLY high to have a view out the windshiled like that!!!

Green1 wrote:Most likely, you can't... (though I could be wrong, I've seen that sort of thing in some software, it's just very uncommon) the person who originally programmed the software decided this one for you. Unfortunately for you, they chose a more precise definition of "arrived" than you have.

Generally I have overcome this problem by going off course to the coffee shop and then getting back on course. My Garmin girl gets a little miffed by this but usual gets over it, unless I do it too often in which case she just says "You are 183 kilometres from your destination" with a straight line across mountain ranges and lakes ~ and she has gone somewhere for a smoke, a drink and to chill out a little. I leave it for a while then do a little sweet talking, smile a little ~ then we make up. As I turn away from the resolved situation I find myself talking to myself about how I could be doing all this for a machine that I already paid for.... .... but not too loudly.

Falco.