Delica Canada | Mitsubishi Van Club

Earlier this week I bought a small camping trailer and after towing it over the slight slope of the Golden Ears Bridge, I was left feeling the need for more power. I had a hard time holding 70km/h at the steepest point while traveling southbound over that bridge(O/D was off). I wasn't flooring it, but my pedal was pushed far enough that I estimate I would have been hitting about 120km/h had I not been towing a trailer up that incline. Given the lack of responsiveness, I doubt completely flooring it would have made difference. My Delica has had a Deli-tune and I've had no problems comfortably passing slower cars going up steep hills on the Sea to Sky highway, so I doubt there are any problems with my stock Delica, I just think the weight is too much for the stock engine going uphill. The trailer isn't that heavy, it's supposed to be well under 3,500lbs(It's a fiberglass 17' Travelaire KT 170, very similar to the 17' Bigfoots). My research previous to buying this trailer suggested that a stock L400 should be fine pulling up to 5,000lbs based on the trailers that some of the UK guys reported pulling. But, I'm guessing that those UK guy's weren't going up any inclines:-( (On the flat, my Delica had no problems holding 90km/h with the trailer).

Anyway, I only towed the trailer from the sellers home to my Uncles farm in Langley(storing it there for now). At this point, I am making plans to beef up the power of my Delica as I don't want to be one of those guys with a massive line up of cars behind me as I drive around BC.

On that note, I went looking for info on getting more power out of my Delica and I found these two very promising posts(You may have to log in to these sites to view the info, not sure):

http://www.pocuk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=94105

http://www.mdocuk.co.uk/forums/viewtopi ... dee0a3f44d

(Earlier, longer discussion of the info posted in link above)
http://www.pocuk.com/forums/viewtopic.p ... 91b66f11d0

Another post that I can no longer find suggested that the kinds of mods described in the above links could lead to as much as 150hp and 260ft/lb without having to change the turbo, head, or other internal components. (Of course, keeping a very close eye on EGT readings).

As much as I was mechanically inclined in my youth(swapping engines, adjusting valve lash, replacing distributors and adjusting points, etc), I'm not feeling up to taking on this kind of project on my own. I'd like to hire a pro with more diesel(and more importantly, 4m40) experience to help out.

So, I called CVI 3 times this week(Once earlier, twice today) but I never got through to Butch(I left my name and number on the second call this afternoon).

After that, I called Rising Sun but after explaining my quest for more power the fellow there told me I need to learn how to drive my Delica properly. If "learning how to drive my Delica properly" means learning to live with 70km/h on slight slopes and who knows how slow up real hills, my Delica is going on Craigslist and I'll buy something with the balls to keep up with traffic while pulling a trailer(The previous generation touareg tdi with the air suspension and proper transfer case comes to mind). But, before things get to that point, I'd like to give my beloved Delica a chance to do the job...


Of course, my first choice is still Butch as I really enjoyed the results of his "Deli-Tune" back when I first bought my L400. Assuming he calls me back and that he's willing to help out, I feel I'd be in good hands.

But, if Butch isn't comfortable taking the risk of helping me push the limits on my old 4m40, can anyone recommend a reliable and competent mechanic who is familiar with the 4m40 and who would be willing to help me out?

adding throttle and not gains speed in a diesel makes extreme heat....piston melting heat be careful...

I'm sure you will be able to get some more power but it is still a 15 year old 4 cylinder diesel moving 8,500lbs (basically a box pulling a bigger box)...that is only 2.8L... there is no substitution for cubic inches...

mechanical diesels are not gas engines....not a L400 expert but I am thinking craigslist might be the easiest solution...

thedjjack wrote:adding throttle and not gains speed in a diesel makes extreme heat....piston melting heat be careful...

I'm sure you will be able to get some more power but it is still a 15 year old 4 cylinder diesel moving 8,500lbs (basically a box pulling a bigger box)...that is only 2.8L... there is no substitution for cubic inches...

mechanical diesels are not gas engines....not a L400 expert but I am thinking craigslist might be the easiest solution...

My fear is that you might be right about the Craigslist option. But, I'd be willing to throw some cash at the Delica first to see if she'll step up to the plate. I'm happy with the current performance towing around town. Pulling away from stop lights is no problem and accelerating up to 60km/h is fine. But, in top gear with the overdrive off, going up that incline at posted speeds was just too much for the old girl. If I had been able to hold the posted 80km/h up the incline on the Golden Ears bridge, I'd have been happy. Instead, I felt no throttle response and she stuck to 70 km/h so I backed my foot off the throttle and just let her pull at the speed she seemed comfortable with(Didn't want to waste the fuel, didn't realize I was also reducing the risk of melting things).

First mod should be a EGT (exhaust gas temp) gauge and a boost gauge so you can monitor the temperatures and pressures going from stock.

Open up the exhaust can help...

I would also look at a bigger intercooler so if you increase boost you are getting cooler air in...

Also maybe a bigger transmission cooler (heat is not you friend and 3500lbs box is a big trailer)

(Also a 15 foot Trillium trailer would drop 1500lbs, however by by washroom could be an issue)...I would also look at reducing the wind resistance and maybe increasing the rolling resistance...

You could swap in a small block Chevy and give me your 4M40 (I would be so happy with 70km/h pulling 3500lbs in my L300 :) )

Hopefully some L400 people who tow can post....

thedjjack wrote:First mod should be a EGT (exhaust gas temp) gauge and a boost gauge so you can monitor the temperatures and pressures going from stock.

Open up the exhaust can help...

I would also look at a bigger intercooler so if you increase boost you are getting cooler air in...

Also maybe a bigger transmission cooler (heat is not you friend and 3500lbs box is a big trailer)

(Also a 15 foot Trillium trailer would drop 1500lbs, however by by washroom could be an issue)...I would also look at reducing the wind resistance and maybe increasing the rolling resistance...

You could swap in a small block Chevy and give me your 4M40 (I would be so happy with 70km/h pulling 3500lbs in my L300 :) )

Hopefully some L400 people who tow can post....

Thanks for the feedback, in regards to the opening up the exhaust I've been reading older posts and after seeing some positive endorsements I'm going to call up the folks at Muffler Tech (http://mufflertech.ca/about-us.php) with an eye on getting a 2.5" system installed. Another posts mentioned that a bung can be welded on to the new exhaust pipe for the EGT sensor, so I'll ask for that...

Hopefully I hear back from Butch but in the meantime I've read some posts listing ateb.ca as being very knowledgeable with performance tuning JDM diesels. I've also put abbotsfordjapanauto.com on my list based on some positive reviews I read.

Put the prob before the turbo....(EGR blanking plate is the easiest method) as you are going to want to see the temperature before the turbo (Turbo acts as a big heat sink so it slows down the responsiveness of the gauge and also reading as lower)...

Little throttle is instant to how much heat it makes....

thedjjack wrote:Put the prob before the turbo....(EGR blanking plate is the easiest method) as you are going to want to see the temperature before the turbo (Turbo acts as a big heat sink so it slows down the responsiveness of the gauge and also reading as lower)...

Little throttle is instant to how much heat it makes....

Thanks for that pointer!

Agreed here: EGT should be your first mod. AT temp gauge and cooler should be your second. The Oz forum strongly recommends an AT Temp sensor when pulling loads.

There are mods that can increase power, but as others have said, parts could melt or break. Having said that; I am doing a number of mods of my own, but gauges first, mods second for me.

Mr. Flibble wrote:Agreed here: EGT should be your first mod. AT temp gauge and cooler should be your second. The Oz forum strongly recommends an AT Temp sensor when pulling loads.

There are mods that can increase power, but as others have said, parts could melt or break. Having said that; I am doing a number of mods of my own, but gauges first, mods second for me.

Thanks for confirming the info about gauges coming first.

Have you seen any write ups on the Oz forums were they specifically listed hp & torque numbers? I'm curious to find other corroborating reports of what can realistically be achieved without getting too crazy. ie. keeping the turbo and engine stock and just tweaking the items mentioned in those posts I linked to earlier.

On that note, I'm fine paying for a 2.5" exhaust, proper blow off valves and adjustable boost controllers(ie. I'm not looking to go completely ghetto with some of the mods that are described in those links). But, I don't see myself forking out the cash to upgrade a turbo or do internal engine mods.

Based on those modifications, I expect you will notice a difference in power when driving the van on it's own, and maybe you'll go a little faster with a trailer, but to make any real difference, your power to weight ratio will have to change significantly since you are pulling a lot of weight. I'm honestly surprised you can go 70kph up those hills, I'd be doing 30kph in my van with nothing in tow.

nxski wrote:Based on those modifications, I expect you will notice a difference in power when driving the van on it's own, and maybe you'll go a little faster with a trailer, but to make any real difference, your power to weight ratio will have to change significantly since you are pulling a lot of weight. I'm honestly surprised you can go 70kph up those hills, I'd be doing 30kph in my van with nothing in tow.

Well, the golden ears bridge isn't all that steep, more of a gentle incline, so I was hoping for more. I read through the trailer manual today and the dry weight(empty tanks, etc) for the trailer is supposed to be about 2,500lbs. Let's be generous as call it 3,000lbs.

Here is a link to an article listing trucks with >3,500lb tow ratings:

http://www.trucktrend.com/features/cons ... 00_pounds/

I have no hope in matching the hp numbers of those trucks, but the torque numbers would hopefully be achievable with the mods I'm chasing. I recall reading that torque played a bigger role in towing capacity than horsepower, but that horsepower was a major factor in acceleration. I'm not looking to accelerate quickly with the trailer in tow, I'm just hoping to be able to hold a constant speed up mild hills.

For comparison purposes, earlier this year(without a trailer) on the sea to sky highway my l400 never left me wanting more power. (And that's surprising to me as I've owned a lot of muscle cars and sports cars in the past that spoiled me for passing power.) In my other travels with my Delica, hills that I believe were as steep as Fury Creek were easy to hold 100km/h going up. Obviously I'm not expecting to match that with a trailer in tow, I'd be extremely pleased if I was able to hold 80km/h up a hill like Fury Creek. But, 70km/h on gentle inclines is going to be hard to swallow as I don't want to be bottling up traffic and pissing people off on trivial slopes.

Anyway, hopefully this week I can make an appointment to get some of the mods done(Gauges, exhaust, boost controller, blow off valve, and fuel delivery tuning). If Butch and the others discourage me from going down this path, then I'll have to look at other options for a tow vehicle:-(

Grolly: According to the Delica Transmission manual (L400) there is temp-sensor connected to an idiot light on the dash, you could probably wire a gauge to that and get real time readings of the ATF.

As far as power upgrades: Improving air flow through the intercooler and cooling the air charge seem to be the main focus from the Aussie boys I have chatted with.

The Pajero Forum talks a great deal about fluid sprays (water, washer fluid) on the intercooler fins which does help to drop the temp of the incoming air charge via evaporation = more CFM = improved combustion. Along that same line of more CFM there are intercooler tubes available that allow you to replace the braided rubber hoses. TIGWELD4Umakes these in the UK and the local BC Delica importers do occasionally get used sets from wrecked L400's.

I have toying with the idea of making a set out of copper pipe as some rat rodders have done with their ghetto builds.

The big diesel boys and some tuners with a bit-o-savy have been doing propane injection systems for years which helps improve flame propogation in the cylinders and that translates into less unburnt fuel, lower EGT, better throttle response under load and improved torque (which you wanted). But opinions do vary about the danger vs benefit of such a system.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yI5HNjsg9qE

A little research on the website for Banks does yield some data on water/methanol injection systems which are safer than propane for obvious reasons. How you hook their system to a 4M40 would be interesting.

http://www.bankspower.com

Did you happen to switch your transmission to POWER mode while you towed. That little gem changes the shift points and that also helps drop EGT about 100 degrees on the hills. I recently did the Calgary to Vancouver trip with my L400 loaded up and the Power mode was helpful. I ask because you made no mention of that....only that your overdrive was off.

Big-Bird wrote:Grolly: According to the Delica Transmission manual (L400) there is temp-sensor connected to an idiot light on the dash, you could probably wire a gauge to that and get real time readings of the ATF.

As far as power upgrades: Improving air flow through the intercooler and cooling the air charge seem to be the main focus from the Aussie boys I have chatted with.

The Pajero Forum talks a great deal about fluid sprays (water, washer fluid) on the intercooler fins which does help to drop the temp of the incoming air charge via evaporation = more CFM = improved combustion. Along that same line of more CFM there are intercooler tubes available that allow you to replace the braided rubber hoses. TIGWELD4Umakes these in the UK and the local BC Delica importers do occasionally get used sets from wrecked L400's.

I have toying with the idea of making a set out of copper pipe as some rat rodders have done with their ghetto builds.

The big diesel boys and some tuners with a bit-o-savy have been doing propane injection systems for years which helps improve flame propogation in the cylinders and that translates into less unburnt fuel, lower EGT, better throttle response under load and improved torque (which you wanted). But opinions do vary about the danger vs benefit of such a system.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yI5HNjsg9qE

A little research on the website for Banks does yield some data on water/methanol injection systems which are safer than propane for obvious reasons. How you hook their system to a 4M40 would be interesting.

http://www.bankspower.com

Did you happen to switch your transmission to POWER mode while you towed. That little gem changes the shift points and that also helps drop EGT about 100 degrees on the hills. I recently did the Calgary to Vancouver trip with my L400 loaded up and the Power mode was helpful. I ask because you made no mention of that....only that your overdrive was off.

Hey Big-Bird, thanks for the pointers! On the topic of the POWER mode, I did flip that on and play with it but all I noticed was that my RPM would stay much higher without any change in throttle responsiveness or perceived power. It kind of felt like it was holding back my acceleration in that without it, the van would switch gears sooner and keep building speed but with it on, the van would just hold a constant speed at a much higher RPM for what seemed like a very long time before switching gears and then again starting to build more speed. In suburban traffic as I drove from the sellers home in Maple Ridge over to my uncle's place in Langley, I didn't have much difficulty pulling away from stop lights with that switch off.

As mentioned, when I turned it on, the revs definitely stayed higher before switching gears, but I didn't feel any better acceleration or that the vehicle was having any easier time with the load. Without the POWER switch activated and with only the O/D off, the RPM's still stayed high up in the 3,000 range(Can't recall for sure, but I think I was towing at ~3,600rpm for a while but I don't recall the speed in the top gear). Regardless, given that the EGT's should stay lower if I use that switch more often, I'll be sure to engage it for that reason alone...

I sitll haven't heard back from Muffler Tech, but after reading through other forum posts on other car websites, I found a lot of positive references(from the import racing crowd) for a place called Muffler Man on Kingsway(A lot closer to my home than Muffler Tech). For a flange back setup they quoted my in the high $300 dollar range. For comparison, Hoegler's in Richmond quoted high $600 range with no mandrel bending and ATEB quoted $900 [ ! I guess ATEB would just shop it out anyway, probably not their core business ]. I called Muffler Man and the fellow told me they operate on a first come first serve basis, so hopefully I can slip in sometime this week.

Butch just called and he was terrific in answering my questions and giving me his opinions. He's reiterating what many others have said in that I should start with the exhaust and extra instrumentation to monitor heat, boost, etc. He also gave me the same warnings that I risk damaging my vehicle by messing with the boost and fuel, but I'm comfortable taking that risk. My cooling system will need a full going over and I'll be getting some air-bags. Anyway, the worst case scenario if I screw things up is that I walk away from a blown engine and buy a more powerful tow vehicle, a very expensive outcome but not the end of the world for me. Given that the more powerful tow vehicles I'm considering(Touareg v8 or diesel, newer Tacoma off-road) would cost more than triple what my Delica is worth, I'm willing to gamble with these mods...

Butch gave me a list of parts to pick up and then I can hire his shop to do the install work. So, it looks like I've found my guy for the next steps...