An URGENT CALL FOR HELP! Stuck in LA!

[Grungle]

Hi Guys,
well, it was bound to happen.

As some of you know, we've been travelling around North America for the last 6 months...East across canada, south to Florida, west to california and back up north to Vancouver...well, that was the plan. we've covered 50,000km in the last 12 months, and i must admit, it's done very well.

But, the delica died today in LA.

thankfully, it was just inside the campground, so its not stuck on an interstate somewhere.

but i need some help from some fellow delica people to diagnose and hopefully repair the thing.


Here's what happened:
started the car early morning, ran OK. it was cold overnight (2-3C) so took a minute to warm up. Drove about 500m and it started to really slow down, then it died. thats it.

so far, we've pulled the air filter. its clean (enough).
pulled a hose off the fuel filter (the one that heads towards the fuel pump). used the priming pump to push fuel through it and it flowed. so no blockage there.
after priming the system we tried starting the car and it "kicked" (fired) but didnt really start. it turns over, but doesnt run.

here is where we get a bit hazy: is the fuel pump mechanically driven from a belt on the front of the engine? does the fuel go:
tank - fuel filter - fuel pump - injectors - fuel pump - tank?
the belt is fine, it all spins and doesnt make any terrible noises.

Our GUESS is the fuel pump is gone, but what actually "goes" in these things?
now, if it IS the fuel pump, where can i get another one? any chance anyone up there has any contacts in LA?

sorry if this is a bit dis-jointed, just walked 5 miles to find an internet connection and dont have much time before it gets dark.

any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. if anyone knows of a good, cheap way of getting the deli back to vancouver it would be greatly appreciated as well.

thanks,
mark

[jessef]

Injection pump pulls the diesel through into the pipes into the injectors.

If it's turning over, it sounds like fuel delivery.

If your fuel filter is not clogged and you can prime the pump on the filter housing and it comes out in spurts without air, then it could be that your injectors are clogged, glow plugs completely fouled or sleeve stuck closed inside the IP.

Either way, if you can't get it running down there and need to take it somewhere, call around and take it to either a VW mechanic who has worked on bosch VW diesel injection pumps or a diesel mechanic who knows about the Dodge D50 mid-80's pickup truck that came with the Mitsubishi 4D55 engine (same as ours except for the head).

[39Ronin]

Did you fill up recently? I got a bad batch of diesel once. I knew it was the fuel because I filled both my diesels at the same pump and both had problems starting and jack rabbitting when driving once I did get them started.

iIf it is the IP, as Jesse said, you may also find an old IP from the D50 or Ford Ranger. I think the years to look for are 84-86.

[39Ronin]

Hey Grungle I posted your cry for help on 4x4 wire, there are many US members there and quite a few owners with the 4D55 motor.

http://www.4x4wire.com/forums/showflat. ... 14&fpart=1

Hopefully someone will be close to you.

Good luck

[MardyDelica]

you can call me anytime, maybe i can help:
604-720-6144
cheers;
Mardy

[vixentd]

For your delica to run you will need three things
1. Air
2. Fuel
3. Compression
Air
1. Air - If you have checked your airfilter it is not likely the supply of air has been cut off, unlesss you have sucked in a plastic bag into the intake. I have seen that actually happen, on another diesel vehicle.

Fuel
1. Usually when fuel filter goes it will idle but not run under acceleration. However you delica is shut off I believe with a solenoid that shuts off the supply of fuel. Is that solenoid working? Do you have 12 volts to it?
2. The injection pump could be suspect. Have cracked an injector line to see if you have high pressure at the injector. If not then you have a fuel problem. On the bosch pump, which I believe the Delica is a copy of, we have added a small electric pump near the filter to overcome weak pumps. It provides just enough pressure to help the pump build the pressure. usually a injection pump does not go that suddenly. Have you just picked up new fuel and could have moisture blocking the pump?
3. Have you been running any biodiesel. Could you have an algae build up? Is it possible the suction inlet in the tank has gotten plugged, or a line from the tank to filter blocked? On the vw diesels we often will run them from a small 2 liter just of diesel, by hooking it up after the filter. If the vehicle runs then we know it is not the pump.
4. Is it possible that the timing could have jumped. Can you take off the timing belt cover and see how much play is in the timing belt? That could cause the same sympton.

Compression
1. Compression can be impacted by worn rings, or a timing belt that has slipped so the valves are staying open part way when they should be closed.

Your best bet is to find a good aftermarket vw diesel repair fellow who is familar with the diesel motor. The vw diesel is not that different to him than the Delica.

I am vacationing for November in Palm Springs about 120 miles away.

[Grungle]

thanks for your help everyone, good to know there are still people around to give us a hand.

we've finally tracked someone down that is willing to even look at it, and he sounds quite confident he can work it out. we may still need parts (and advice), so Mardy, I might be giving you a call later if we can't find it locally.

as for all of your suggestions vixentd, we went through most of that, but didnt consider the biodiesel. we got a tank of that from somewhere near the grand canyon (a few tanks ago now) and didnt realize until after we'd done it. it ran fine for the whole tank, and we filled up with regular diesel after that...but could be an issue.

we were about 3/4 of the way through a tank (filled up at a busy place in san diego), so i'm not thinking bad fuel, but who knows. it just died so suddenly...it slowed down, then it was out. goodnight.

I'll certainly let you know what happens. thanks again for your help so far...we're a few days (and a few $$$) out so far, but hopefully we'll be up and running again soon.

it just turned over 150,000km too - 45,000km in 12 months isn't bad!

Mark

[bae146]

Check too see if the fuel shut off solenoid on the injector pump has power and is functioning

[after oil]

http://www.delica.ca/forum/fuel-shut-of ... -3810.html

the fuel shut off solenoid, when energized allows fuel to the IP, when you turn you key off, it deenergizes and stops the fuel. in other words: in a gasoline vehicle when you turn the key it quits sending a current to the spark plugs thus no ignition. in a diesel because there is no ignition the engine must be deprived of fuel to shut off.

its on the back of the IP with some wires going to it. it bolts in like an oil pressure sender. i think there must be a coil or a magnet inside and a piston. when enrgized the piston is pulled back allowing the fuel to pass. when de-energized the spring pushes the piston and stops the fuel.

when i was in E4 in duncan after breaking down john took the old solenoid to the bench to test it out. with a battery charger he could give it power. it worked about 4 times out of 5.

if its working you can hear and feel it click. you can also put a 12v test light on it to see if its energized...

[CVI]

There is a solenoid switch on top of the injection pump that is the main control of fuel into the pump. Check that one first assuming the engine is turning and the timing belts are ok. Or an easier way to check if fuel is coming into your system is loosening one of the 17mm lines to the injectors and see if fuel will spurt out. \if fuel is visible while starting it, there's no problem with your injection pump. Check cam timing or timing belt condition if ok. For the delica to run 500m before abruptly stopping without any initial loss of power and spurting to stop can mean an electrical issue. If it run another 500 m losing power and hearing no clanking noise before coming to a stop could mean a fuel starvation (delica run some more meters on what fuel is left inside the pump).

Good luck.

[Grungle]

Now we're getting somewhere. I have passed on a lot of information that has come up on here, and we think we've got it worked out.

to clarify:
the van lost power initially (but smoothly), then it died. no spluttering or anything, it just lost power, i put my foot down a bit more, nothing happened, and 30m later it was dead. i had time to pull into a car park.

when we opened up an injector line and turned it over a small amount of fuel came out, but not the amount i was expecting.

so we just got off the phone to the repair shop. he said the pick-up pump is gone, most likely caused by the ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel in North America. He says he's seen it before in old diesels that have been brought into the country, and he doesnt see any problem getting it fixed. so thats good news!

Now, I'm assuming Canada has similar legislation regarding diesel fuel (as the US)? Our van had 105,000km on it when we got it 12 months ago, and since then has done 45,000km (about 15,000km in the States). Now, could this be a problem for ALL delicas running on ultra-low sulfur diesel (ULSD) and it's just that we've done SO MANY Km so quickly?

Does anyone know for a fact that ULSD DOESN'T hurt the seals in the Delica fuel system? Has anyone else out there done 45,000km on ULSD? it seems like a logical problem, but i haven't read about it anywhere else (other than the IPs leaking).

Anyway, he says it'll be 3, possibly 4 days to rebuild it (if it requires a full rebuild) and we'll be on our way again. we'll call in a couple of hours and he should have a price for us. fingers crossed!

[MardyDelica]

Hi, we all know that the fuel here in northamerica has low sulfur on it.
thats why i recommend each delica owner to put diesel additive everytime they fill up there tank.
as per the seal or other component that damage the pump sometime cannot be avoidable as we have to think that this car is 15 year old & never done anything in japan since new.
i been driving delica for long time now 41/2 years so far even my delica leaks fuel also, so no choice, the oring or seal usually got swollen, so not much we can do about. well just have to rebuilt & change the seal on this pump as they never change it since new in japan. as per rebuilding the pump there in us to where the shop you are dealing. see if they really know what there doing if they can do it right not just fix it temporary. i can help you with your pump if need help send it to you rebuilt & just install it. just give me a buzz if need help, hope everything will be o.k. for you over there in LA.
Cheers;
Mardy

[TardisDeli]

Hey Grungle, I think Mardy's latest post (just above this) is a superb idea -- have Mardy send you a rebuilt pump from here. Unless your guy there can get the rebuild kit, and knows what he is doing, and has patience. I recall seeing mine laid out on the counter being rebuilt, the dozens of tiny bits and the mention of how difficult it is to ensure you put everything back correctly (bits fit in ether way up but are slightly different sized ends. Good Luck, Christine.

[jessef]

Agree with Mardy about using additives in the sulfur NA diesel.

With regards to the inj pump, if your mechanic has worked on VW diesel bosch pumps, then he'll know how to work on yours just by looking at it.

[Grungle]

He's positive he can fix it - he said we'll be back on the road by Thursday at the latest. He said he's got a lot of experience with Bosch systems and that these pumps are used on a number of other things as well.
As for the cost - he says around $400 for labor and $800-$1200 for the pump rebuild (depending on what it needs). I think that's on the high side ( I was expecting maybe $1000 total), but this IS LA, and we want it done quickly (we've still got a lot of things we want to see and we're only allowed to be in the US for 3 more weeks).