Problems starting in the morning or when cold ? Adjustment

[Rising Sun Auto Import]

If you have a faulty relay, broken ECU or no power to busbar , it wouldn’t start in 3 seconds( absolutely no way ).
But video shows it starts in 3 sec.after 2nd click with lots of white smoke and hesitating ( as he has to press gas pedal to maintain RPM ).

There’s no chance to puff white smoke if fuel delivery system works fine.
Pls read previous postings by jcolvin.

How can you explain white smoke in start up?
In your standard, white smoke in start up is normal?

What you mean “Thanks for coming out”?

Steven

[jcolvin]

I met up with Fishtank after work today for a parking lot detective session. Looks like I am getting 0 power out of the relay, it clicks like it is working but not getting any voltage.

I guess I have been compression only starting my van since purchase (it started poorly until mid-april when it warmed up) lol. Considering that it is actually pretty impressive I get started at all.

Yay another part to purchase and another day off spent working on the L400... I'm having VW flashbacks...

Well that does sound like the glow relay! You can get a glow relay at lordco for $25 (although it probably wont fit in the stock location). But before you change it, make sure that your wires are good. The problem could be the wire between the fusible link and the relay, or the wire between the relay and the 1st glow plug. You could try hooking the 1st plug directly to the battery (you can clamp the connector to the terminal with vicegrips if you are careful), wait 5 secs, then crank, (then once its running disconnect so you dont glow the plugs too long and burn them out). I've got to go back and fiddle again today, i suppose there is a possibility my brand new relay has crapped out but it seems unlikely.

[Profister]

If you have a faulty relay, broken ECU or no power to busbar , it wouldn’t start in 3 seconds( absolutely no way ).

This is not true. This is what it takes to fire up a 4M40 engine without working glow plugs depending on the air temperature.

There’s no chance to puff white smoke if fuel delivery system works fine.

Oh, yeah. There is a good fat 100% chance to blow white smoke of atomized unburnt diesel fuel if the plugs don't glow and the engine is cold.

How can you explain white smoke in start up?

Read above.
You should refrain from posting in the technical section. Your 'troubleshooting' recommendations are more confusing than helpful.

[psilosin]

It is a weird coincidence that it is nice and sunny outside and I am too sick to go to work...

Anyway I appreciate all comments as everyone is trying to be helpful so lets not have a war over it. I did some follow up testing and the relay is 100% dead. All power is fine up to the relay but the switched post is providing 0 power. I have removed the relay and bench tested it as well and the coroner certified it with a death certificate.

Now off to Lordco. I have a nice relay that looks like it would fit but the terminal posts are too large and I would rather not redo all the wire connectors so Ill save that for last resort.

By the way...holy #@$% is that awkward unbolting the relay...tight fit. Also for anyone else thinking of removing the relay please take note that the source terminal is hot always and you will without question at some point bump your tool on the chassis trying to remove it so disconnect your battery as step 1 unless you want fireworks.

[jessef]

I learned my lesson years ago on the Pajero. Now I wrap it in coated electrical tape to shield it from touching the body.

Good on you for getting to the source. Some people make these engines out to be much more complicated than they really are.

[Profister]

If you need to cross reference the part number here is what I got from ASA.

[psilosin]

Hope I am not speaking too soon but it looks like the problem is solved.

I ended up wiring in another entire parallel glow circuit (wires, relay, trigger) so the factory/mardy circuit can remain as is and if I get another official mitsubishi relay it can take over again. I made a simple extension harness so I could still use the coolant sensor trigger so my new system operates just like factory. Used a 120amp relay and 4ga wire and mounted the relay on the egr blanking plate.

It was very satisfying to hear click....click...instant Vrooom and see no white smoke cloud as if it was a nice 35oC summer day. Now i just need a glow plug system for myself after being outside all day...brrrrrrrrr.

Thanks everybody for the help!

[jcolvin]

Hope I am not speaking too soon but it looks like the problem is solved.

I ended up wiring in another entire parallel glow circuit (wires, relay, trigger) so the factory/mardy circuit can remain as is and if I get another official mitsubishi relay it can take over again. I made a simple extension harness so I could still use the coolant sensor trigger so my new system operates just like factory. Used a 120amp relay and 4ga wire and mounted the relay on the egr blanking plate.

It was very satisfying to hear click....click...instant Vrooom and see no white smoke cloud as if it was a nice 35oC summer day. Now i just need a glow plug system for myself after being outside all day...brrrrrrrrr.

Thanks everybody for the help!

Nice. That's what I did and it seemed to work for 3 days then back to the smoking and sputtering (don't want to jinx you :) ) I put my new relay flat on top of the battery where it *just* fit (thought perhaps mounting it to the engine would be too much vibration/heat) and likewise extended the factory trigger wire.

I have to go poke around and see if perhaps my new relay or plugs have crapped out.

[psilosin]

Nice. That's what I did and it seemed to work for 3 days then back to the smoking and sputtering (don't want to jinx you :) )

Alas and alack. Oh woes me. Shiver me timbers. Sacre bleu. Fudgesicle. Daaaaamnit....

Today I had to zip out on a CT/Rona run and the L400 was back to its old tricks. It was -2oC out and it took about 40 seconds of solid cranking to get fired up. Created enough smoke while cranking to fill up half my back yard in a solid cloud lol! Pretty epic if it didn't actually suck...

I didn't have time to poke aorund and do any testing so not sure what the deal is now yet. I know for 100% that my old relay was dead but I would be quite surprised if my new one is already. If it is then that is either a) bad luck or b) something going on thats cooking relays....or c) maybe my relay is still fine and now I am dealing with the ECU/coolant sensor trigger being a weirdo. Something to inspect further tomorrow.

I should wire up a couple indicator lights that show when the trigger wire is active and when the relay is active, with the thinking that they should both be lit for normal (or trouble further downstream), trigger only would mean trouble at the relay, neither would indicate ecu/sensor problem.

I don't really have time right now to do much investigating though. If the relay checks out ok then I am just going to wire up a pushbutton and make the glow system manual and let the ECU go on vacation for the rest of the winter. Its so much nicer solving problems when its 30oC out.

[Rising Sun Auto Import]

Nice. That's what I did and it seemed to work for 3 days then back to the smoking and sputtering (don't want to jinx you :) )

Alas and alack. Oh woes me. Shiver me timbers. Sacre bleu. Fudgesicle. Daaaaamnit....

Hi psilosin,
Why don’t you simply replace new or used OEM 11V glow plug relay if you have original ECU system alive?
Unlike 6.2 V system restoration, there’s no issue to recover 11V “self regulating glow plug system”.
I would say do not try modification or something from unknown source as it can lead huge damage/big expense most of the time.
Simply try original parts for easy fix.

Steven

[psilosin]

Hi Steven,

I understand your concern and it is good to be cautious but the relay I am using I believe is more heavy duty than the Mitsubishi unit. If the new relay checks out when I test it tomorrow that would lead me to believe that something in the 'self regulating' ECU isn't doing the best job of self regulating itself and is failing to activate the relay. In that case if I temporarily make the system manual control (with a momentary push button, not a switch, for safety) and if everything works well for a length of time under manual control then one could have confidence in concluding that the ECU/sensor was the source of the lastest problem. If its is teh ECU or sensor well its too cold and I'm too busy right now to mess around with that until spring . Another benefit of testing with a manual system is it provides more data, if things still do not go well under manual control then that would point to the problem originating outside the glow system. Eventually when the issue is solved (and its warm outside) I plan to get everything back to facory including a new oem relay just to keep it clean looking.

*On the other hand if I find the new relay is also now cooked then I'll just swap in another and see how it goes...if that then also cooks then something more sinister than bad luck is happening to my relays. In that case I will just swap insurance over to my Hilux Surf for the rest of the winter haha.

[Profister]

Psilosin: if you are interested in diagnosing the glow plug ECU (SRG is the correct name) I can provide schematics for the SRG and for the tester.

[psilosin]

Interesting. The new relay I just installed on Tuesday is toast.

Trigger wire from ECU (SRG) is operating fine supplying voltage for ~6 seconds. Power supply to the relay is fine. 0 power at the switched terminal when activated. Not yet bench tested but it looks dead by all account.

Jcolvin, I am interested if you had a chance to re-test your new relay to see if it cooked as well. I'm going to pick up another today and reinstall to see if this is just bad luck or if shinanagans are afoot.

For fun here is another startup video. This time trying to start the L400 at -4oC. I got tired of eating smoke sandwich so I gave up before she fired (sensitive viewer alert: f-bomb dropped).

[jessef]

Did you check the connection (that leads directly to the solenoid) at the fuse block at the positive terminal on the battery?

By your previous diagnostics, you ruled out the fuel system which is good.

Narrowing it down to the solenoid popping will trace back to either the fuse block at the battery or the ECU.

You're temporary solution to engage it manually is a good one. That will allow you to troubleshoot easier.

If its the ECU, then have it repaired whenever you can. You're on the right track.

[psilosin]

Did you check the connection (that leads directly to the solenoid) at the fuse block at the positive terminal on the battery?

By your previous diagnostics, you ruled out the fuel system which is good.

Narrowing it down to the solenoid popping will trace back to either the fuse block at the battery or the ECU.

You're temporary solution to engage it manually is a good one. That will allow you to troubleshoot easier.

If its the ECU, then have it repaired whenever you can. You're on the right track.

Yep, checked the supply power lines to relay...all good. And the ECU is activating the trigger wire (likely not the proper terminology) that activates the relay so it seems the ECU is acting normal. Tested the relay with a seperate trigger and while it clicks no power ends up to the switched pole so like before it looks like the relay is the issue. The question now is, is a second relay failing within days just bad luck or can something be cooking it? You would think a fuse would blow before the relay itself if there is some crazy power surge happening though. It is extra interesting since Jcolvin looks to have had the same scenario play out. If the relay cooks again I am definately going manual control as the next step...have such a nice shiny boat horn button in my bucket of parts for years just waiting for a use.

I am positive the fuel system is not at fault as you say. There is 0 volts going to the glow plugs...100% an electrical issue. Other tips that the fuel system was not the issue was fuel ecconomy is normal and she runs without a hiccup after starting. My Hilux with a mild IP leak exhibits a very different scenario...fuel filter needs pumping up after a few days of no driving and it is easy to start but bucks and misses for 10-20 seconds until idle smooths and chugs and hestiates while driving for a couple minutes until the IP seal swells up, and fuel ecconomy took a hit.