lack of power black smoke. Help!

[on the road]

I bought a L400 last Oct on the island. Paid a premium for what I though to be a mechanicaly clean van. It ran good when I picked it up and drove it back to Calgary. By the time I got it home it had started to blow a lot of black smoke (filling the whole block) on starts after sitting for a few hours. And as the winter got colder the starts got harder. Then the thermostat went and cold air blowing in, and sever lack of power. I tried injector cleaner, filter changes. I got a warranty with the van and took it into a local shop, had the injectors rebuilt ( it was running on one good one), the thermostat got replaced, glow plugs and pinion seal.
Now not much has changed, the power is still alot less than when I first got it and lots of black smoke and hard to start. Im thinking maybe fuel pump? Does anyone have any Ideas or similar experience?
Thanks

[loki]

I bought a L400 last Oct on the island. Paid a premium for what I though to be a mechanicaly clean van. It ran good when I picked it up and drove it back to Calgary. By the time I got it home it had started to blow a lot of black smoke (filling the whole block) on starts after sitting for a few hours. And as the winter got colder the starts got harder. Then the thermostat went and cold air blowing in, and sever lack of power. I tried injector cleaner, filter changes. I got a warranty with the van and took it into a local shop, had the injectors rebuilt ( it was running on one good one), the thermostat got replaced, glow plugs and pinion seal.
Now not much has changed, the power is still alot less than when I first got it and lots of black smoke and hard to start. Im thinking maybe fuel pump? Does anyone have any Ideas or similar experience?
Thanks

the timing belt might have jumped a tooth and the injection timing is way off because of it.

[Green1]

These vans do not automatically compensate for altitude, as a result, in Calgary with the thinner air, your fuel-air mixture is too rich, it needs to be dialled back.

[impalator]

As to the post regarding the timing belt slipping a tooth... I thought the L400's have a timing chain as opposed to a belt?

I would check your ECU (the thing that makes the glow-plugs glow on cold start-ups - and it may in fact control even more on L400's than it does on the 300's) and maybe you have some dirt in the fuel filter or so - or a plugged airfilter?

I had a few instances on my L300 where, upon heavy acceleration (as heavy as it goes for an L300 mind you) it would emit a massive trail of black smoke (imagine the tractor-pulling contests - with the exception that these guys run huge engines as opposed to a timid 2.5L)... I recently had CVI do a delica-tune and was told that the spray pattern of some of the injectors was more like a squirt rather than a mist... which would likely have been the reason for dirty combustion and black smoke - since then I've had much cleaner and smoother starts and the machine is running faster and smoother under any conditions while fuel mileage is better too.... A delica tune would probably not be a bad thing for you....

[on the road]

Thanks for the input guys. I am going to take it into fuel automotive in strathmore, he sounds really confident on being able to fix my Deli. His thought on my descrption is the timming, so I'll start there.
I am surprised how many machanics I've been to trying to figure this out. I spent 2 grand (warranty) including rebuilt injectors, you think the timing would be part of it.

[jessef]

Remove the bus bar connecting the glowplugs.

Cut the corroded end of the glowplug wire so you have good wire.

Feed a wire for each glowplug from the main lead.

This will ensure all four plugs are getting juice at startup.

Also try advancing the timing.

There is a non-turbo and turbo timing settings.

[Green1]

if it was fine at low altitude (Vancouver) and not fine at high altitude (Calgary) and you've already done all that work, You're looking in the wrong place, looking at the same stuff again won't help much.

[jessef]

Replacing the glowplugs won't do much if all four are not getting their required voltage.

Also being in the colder climate will differ than the warmer at Vancouver for startup. The starting problem was most likely there when you bought the van and showed up when it got colder. That's common.

[Green1]

Speaking as a Calgarian, with a Delica.

The only relevant difference between Vancouver and Calgary is altitude.

The van was adjusted at sea level, it needs to be adjusted for high altitude.

This is a very common problem, and easily fixed by turning down the fuel mixture.

[EnviroImports.com]

Check your Throttle position sensor voltage, mine did the same thing as yours and turned out the TPS was TOTTALY fried, not just out of sync, 4.9 volts going in, and 4.9 volts coming out... screwed up my shift patterns and made me smoke out my driveway until warm.

Jessie helped me with the TPS numbers, he is a wealth of information on the L400s

Black Smoke, your EGR is probably stuck open, dumping HOT exhaust gas into your intake manifold, killing all your power and pumping out black smoke like a tractor pull show..
you can pull the egr valve off in about 5 min, soak it in solvent open it scrape it out, clean it out , and either put it back on, or call me for a set of blanking plates, plug the vacume line to it and forget about it for ever, this is also the ideal time to mount a Pyrometer into the exhaust side. OR clean it and put it back on...

Also , and this is more likely what I think your issue is rather than some of the other things listed previous, BUT in adition to the EGR ....Pull out your battery, be Gentle with it, put a small glass jar similar to a baby food jar under your fuel filter and bleed out some fuel, there is a drain on the bottom, Or change your fuel filter, great time to do it.... is your fuel dark, BLACK maybe.... if its not regular diesel color and has any darkness to it, your seal on the front of your IP is shot where it goes into the back of the oil pump...., $30 in parts, 5 hours in labor, Ive seen a Majority of L400 with this issue , the seals are prone to leaking and break down, so you get engine oil into your IP and also AIR, so it doesent combust properly and eventually leads to vapor locks and stalling engines.

I hope that helps a bit, if you want the new seals for the front of the IP, (only need them if your fuel from the filter is black or dark) they are cheap and fit in an envelope for shipping so its about $1. for shipping.

[FalcoColumbarius]

You know... this really strikes me as the sort of conversation that would take place in L400 Technical. I think I'm going to move it.

Falco.

[psilosin]

The van was adjusted at sea level, it needs to be adjusted for high altitude.

This is a very common problem, and easily fixed by turning down the fuel mixture.

?? We are talking TURBO diesel here are we not? Turning down the fuel mixture on a turbo diesel regardless of altitude will not help with black smoke AND a lack of power issue. If he still had Full Power then the black smoke would be indicative of too much fuel (still not related to altitude in a turbo diesel though) and leaning the mixture would be a good idea but that's not the issue his Delica is experiencing.

Even if the engine doesn't have a HAC (high altitude compensator), the Turbo already compensates for altitude since it creates greater than sea level atmospheric pressure by its very nature, so altitude is irrelevant. The wastegate psi is a physical value so if your turbo is set to wind up to 7psi, it will wind up to 7psi at sea level or on mount everest and the amount of O2 in the intake charge is the same.

HACs are only required on naturally aspirated diesels to reduce smoke at high altitude since their lack of turbo means that as the elevation increases the available O2 to burn per intake volume decreases. HACs are essentially the opposite of a boost compensator...instead of adding fuel as boost increases they decrease fuel as atmospheric pressure decreases. If a NA diesel engine had no HAC device then you would have to manually turn down the fuel mixture to prevent excess smoking. The reduced fueling at altitude is why NA diesel have less power at altitude while their turbo brothers are unaffected.

In this case something is preventing the fuel delivered from being fully used resulting in the black smoke out the tail pipe AND low power. The suggestion by enviroimports regarding a fault in the EGR system sounds bang on. If excess exhaust is contaminating the intake charge that means that there is less O2 available than there should be to the amount of fuel...result: lower power AND black smoke.

[Green1]

Both Mardy and CVI adjust Alberta Delicas specifically for high altitude, my last Turbo diesel had an automatic altitude compensator, however the Delicas do not.
The "turbo" part doesn't make a difference, either way the vehicle needs to be adjusted for altitude, without doing so you WILL get black smoke and loss of power, I have personally been through this several times (first when my altitude compensator corroded and jammed on my previous TURBO diesel vehicle while at sea level, and later with my first delica, I have also witnessed it with Erebus' delica (CVI adjusted the fuel mixture for high altitude and gave Erebus instructions for fine tuning it once he got home)) When I bought my L400 Mardy specifically adjusted it for altitude because he knew I would be spending most of my time in Alberta.

As for your talk about the wastegate, that's irrelevant, under normal conditions with a properly functioning turbo, you never get up to enough pressure to trigger it. which means that what seems to be 11psi at sea level, will be less at altitude, Turbos are also not a constant boost, they vary their boost, they aren't running full-open all the time (and when they are, you'll probably get some black smoke no matter what altitude you're at!)

Symptoms of a broken altitude compensator (or in this case a vehicle adjusted for the wrong altitude) are (And this isn't me making stuff up, this is experience talking): works great at sea level, however after driving to altitude you find huge amounts of black smoke coupled with significant loss of power.

conversely, if your adjustment is out the other way (set for altitude and you're at sea level) you will get some white smoke, and loss of power (though i find that a high altitude adjustment causes less problems at sea level than a sea level adjustment does at altitude)

Common problem, easy (and cheap) solution.

[psilosin]

As for your talk about the wastegate, that's irrelevant, under normal conditions with a properly functioning turbo, you never get up to enough pressure to trigger it. which means that what seems to be 11psi at sea level, will be less at altitude, Turbos are also not a constant boost, they vary their boost, they aren't running full-open all the time (and when they are, you'll probably get some black smoke no matter what altitude you're at!)

C'mon now...stop kidding around. A properly functioning turbos reach their operating psi within a a few seconds of accelerating. A wastegate/dump valve or whatever you want to call it is an integral part of the turbo. Even a weak turbo can easily wind up to a boost level more than the engine can safely handle...hence the wastegate sets the general upper operating psi limit. When the pressure exceeds a certain value it starts pushing open the wastegate to release pressure so it stops climbing and stays steady. Have you not heard of shimming wastegate or using a bleed valve before the wastegate as ways of increasing your max operating boost levels? Perhaps you are thinking of an overboost fuel cut not being reached under normal conditions?...many engine either have a mechanical or electrical method of limiting fuel if boost levels get too high to help prevent engine damage...from a malfunctioning wastegate usually...or an over eager tuner.

11psi is 11psi no matter what altitude...it is a unit of measure...at altitude the air is thinner but the turbo compacts it to a pressure value just the same as it would at sea level...11psi is 11psi. If your turbo maintains a boost psi of 11psi at sea level it will maintain a boost psi of 11psi at altitude as well. It won't 'seem' to be 11psi...it is 11psi.

Yeah turbos operate at variable boost...hence the boost compensator...that varies the fuel with boost level so the fuel isn't running at 'full open' all the time either...whats your point here? And yeah if you are blowing black smoke at full boost AND you have full power you likely have too much fuel and can crank it down a tad. We agree on that as I had already said.

I am not arguing that there is not some fine tuning for optimal emissions on the L400 for operating at elevation like an off boost preliminary fuel setting...I take your word on that. The point is telling him to turn down his fuel delivery will likely lessen some black smoke but it makes little sence that turning down the fuel delivery will also restore his lost power so hge should keep looking for a better solution that soves both problems. Maybe the adjustment done to your L400 is not quite what you think it is and involves more complexity than simply turning down the fuel delivery.

[Green1]

C'mon now...stop kidding around.

I'm being dead serious, on all of these points, this is stuff I KNOW, this is not stuff I have made up. How much experience do you have with a Turbo Diesel engine working at altitude? (I have over 10 years driving one in Calgary (and all the way across Canada both directions)) I have had this exact problem personally on 2 vehicles, and I have preemptively had it solved on my current one by my importer. I have also seen it done by one of Canada's most reputable Delica mechanics on at least one more local (Calgary) Delica. Are you saying that neither of these well respected shops know what they are doing either?

As has been discussed in previous threads, the Delica turbo does not have a wastegate, it does however have a pressure relief valve, something you hear very loudly when it is activated (mine does so frequently, but on a healthy turbo it should very rarely activate (this is the part people shim when they increase their boost)

11psi may be 11psi, but you don't have all 11psi all the time.

As for the lost power, Adjusting this simple adjustment certainly restored mine.

And yes, it is simply adjusting the fuel delivery.

You are trying to make a very simple problem sound complicated and expensive, it isn't.

I have been through this for myself three times on three different vehicles, and on another member's delica once, I know what I'm talking about here. Just because it doesn't make sense to you personally doesn't mean it is wrong.